Season 3 Episode 17: Separation, the Family Home and Your Financial Future
When a relationship ends, one of the first questions people ask is: what happens to the house?
Can I keep it? Can I afford to buy somewhere else? Will I need to rent? Where will the kids live? Separation is one of the biggest financial and emotional changes we can go through – and because most of us only do it once, it's hard to know where to start.
In this episode, Mel and Darlene share what they see in their one-to-one chats with people going through a separation, and the steps that help people move forward with more confidence and clarity.
We discuss:
Mel and Darlene's money truths: when life doesn't go to plan, Darlene's feelings about the word "retirement", and why Mel is protecting her long-term savings for the first time
Why it pays to be deliberate about how much you spend today versus how much you set aside for tomorrow
The assumptions people make about who can (and can't) keep the family home
Why getting a home loan as an individual is different from applying as a couple – and why it's never too early to find out your borrowing capacity
How stretching yourself to keep the house initially can buy you time to make your next decision on your own terms
The experts who can help, from mortgage brokers to divorce coaches and intermediaries
Why knowing your numbers at different settlement splits can help you move forward
This week's TMC Take is that it's never too early to think about it – even when your relationship is happy. Be empowered with your numbers and stay involved in your household finances. If you're already going through a separation, bring in a fair third party to help, make sure you walk away with your fair share, and remember you don't need to solve all of life in one go.
It's a topic many of us will experience, either ourselves or through someone we love. We hope this conversation helps you take the next step, whenever you're ready.
ABOUT THE MONEY COLLECTIVE PODCAST
Financial Wellbeing with The Money Collective brings together the stories and insights Darlene Neu and Mel Pearce have gained through working with thousands of Australians and helping them navigate their finances.
With more than 50 years of combined experience in banking and finance, Darlene and Mel break down the barriers we face every day when it comes to money, relationships and family life. It's an honest, no-holds-barred podcast about financial wellbeing and the role money plays in all our lives.
READY TO BEGIN YOUR FINANCIAL WELLBEING JOURNEY?
Get to know your cost of living by listing your expenses using our handy spending review spreadsheet: https://www.themoneycollective.com.au/resources
Book a time to chat with us, ask questions and talk about all things financial wellbeing, home loans and more. Email team@themoneycollective.com.au
Take action and improve your financial wellbeing with our online course: https://www.themoneycollective.com.au/onlinecourse
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Welcome to the Money Collective Podcast. We're here to uplift your financial well-being. Your hosts are me, Mel Pearce and Darlene Neu. We are the co-founders of The Money Collective and together we have over 50 years of finance and banking experience. We provide the tools, information and guidance to better understand your money and feel confident making money decisions.
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Hey, happy day. Let's do it.
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All right. Welcome to another side of financial well-being with The Money collective.
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I'm now and I'm telling you.
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And we talk about financial well-being on this podcast, which is how you feel about your money. And so it would be not right if we didn't.
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Talk about how we felt about our life and just all the rollercoaster of life of money rides for everybody. You know, nobody really has this sorted. Yeah. Yeah.
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So for me, I don't know. My first if I want to talk about feelings and money, I may say that the first word that comes to mind is.
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A book or like, just like that on more of a side.
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Anyway, it's emotive.
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It is a rollercoaster ride, you know, like, Yeah, in our personal lives, you know, if you're in business, obviously in business, you know, the highs and lows of Hello, Apollo. Hello.
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We have a dog with us. If you're watching a video.
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Recording and still. Yeah. And yeah, so you know the feelings, I think well to notice what the feelings you get at particular times.
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Of the month.
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Well that but also depending on how money's going like what's your reactive position. I want to feel a measured position. Yes. And should you make reactive decisions or.
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Yeah.
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Because you know, I think personally, Dennis is working at the moment. Right. And so that's extended, you know, so he has me working since February. And, you know, my reactive position is, well, you know, a bit like you not that oh, that you're talking about, but more the, you know, like that heightened, you know, just you just don't.
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Yeah. Yeah. And you know, where does that come from in a belief system? Yes. You know, knowing the number, it's a noise, but there's still a feeling of it's not how you planned it.
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Yes. Yeah. It's like it's not going to plan D.
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That's right. So I, yeah, it's like the plan. The plan was to work three more years to get Lily through school. Yeah. And so trying to overlay that, like, financially, of course.
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But can you?
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Really. Where the belief comes from. Yeah. Anyway, you keep going about. How are you feeling? No, I just want to go back to your form.
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A minute there, because, like with the lily and the finishing school, that's about belief.
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Sure. But actually, it was very practical. It was actually the plan.
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It was a money plan. Right. Which is it makes sense for cash flow cause she's got school fees and it would make sense for the household to be earning income to pay for those school fees during that time.
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Exactly. Otherwise, what the school you know, I wish all families served somebody else a year that has to come from somewhere. So you, either you know, you take it from your retirement money. That's right. Absolutely. So, yeah.
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But it doesn't and I suppose it doesn't matter when Dennis does those three, you know, you could still break even. There's so many things that can happen. We can make more money in our business or all the things like we don't know what's ever around the corner. And the thing is, it's great if you've got the resilience to get yourself through those times, obviously, because it gives you choices.
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I'm not going to be destitute.
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What it's left with is the feeling that it wasn't the plan. This isn't right what it was.
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Supposed to be. And we talk a lot about contingency and backup planning. And even though, you know, Sure, you know, we've got resources to pull on. Hmm. It's the feeling that it's not the. Yes. You know, and eating.
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Into those resources, they had a different purpose. And now it's this and that. Now they make other choices. Yeah. I have to think more about this. It's not as easy.
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Yeah, and it has a more emotional feel. Yeah. And then, you know, if I extend on that, which was going to be my truth today is I've talked a little bit about this before, but the whole retirement it the word is just so triggering to me and you know incidences is 58 you know, and he wants to do something of purpose and value.
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But if I've got this belief this comes down to beliefs, right? My belief is that if you don't have purpose and value and work that you, you know, ultimately are going to die sooner. Yeah, that's it. Yeah. And how that might trigger wither away in an armchair watching television.
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Right now anyway. But yeah, so actually I was away with friends on the weekend and this came up because this is obviously in front of my, you know, entire being. And I feel like I've been a bit flat for the last couple of weeks. But really, what's behind it is that there's nothing to do. You know, we've you know, we work a lot on the business and strategy and vision, which is so exciting.
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You know, it can be stressful, too, you know, because you've got to fund it and do all those things. But it's not it's not that it's coming from a place of, you know, a possible transition of, you know, with it. Dennis looks a lot, which is ridiculous because in a rational sense, it's okay.
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But you're worried about all these other things as just money.
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It's his health.
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His wellbeing.
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With the dynamics of the family.
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Having enough fun in your life, you know that that's important. That feeling of mortality is really, you know, big. You know? Yes.
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And I know this is hard. And we're going to talk about this a bit today, but because it's a partner thing, like you're not Dennis, you're not responsible for it. You can't answer these questions for him. We need to get him in as a guest.
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We do on the podcast. Exactly. Because then my values and my overlays we get and these come up too, because then it's like, you know, when you've been in a relationship for a very long time. Do you want to join it? Look, I never had so joined at the hip or do you want to be seen as too complete individuals that are doing life together?
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I'm the latter. Yeah. No, I'm the latter. So because you don't want to do everything, you know, to get you know, you want to be able to do that, to do things, settling outcomes.
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This is the same for you actually in the last few months about what other people are doing, whether you think it's right or.
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Yeah, yes, this is probably happening to the whole of this. I know. Well that was yeah, actually, yes, that's true. And I think I'm working through, you know that because anyway, coming back to the retirement thing, just to cover that all so my friend sent me afterwards, you know, a little video or something. She loved us studies and things, but there was a study done in the US of people that retire in the fifties or 55 and I don't know what the cities die with. 89% die within the decade.
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So it just proves my belief. Yes, one study in realistic terms, but you know. Oh yeah, you know.
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In the air. But you say in here what you want to say and all of those things.
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Yeah, but it is, it does challenge again and if people are at that stage, you know, how are you going to live your life together and do everything.
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And do everything planned. Yeah. Mapped out. Do you know what I mean? You know how you plan. You're not in a game plan right now. Like I game is like, not happening, but, like, how boring would that be anyway? Locked us. Obviously not work like that.
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It really does. People itching to challenge me for a reason. What I'm going to grow from it and learn.
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Just watch and listening and do all the things and let a student.
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Exactly.
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Fine. Oh, we'll find out. You'll find out. Exactly.
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Yeah. Support and lift and raise with me. Doubt trying to determine what's right or wrong for people is a hard thing to do.
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Yeah. And then, you know the message you know from you know that finance a but it's about again moving into life stages. We work with a lot of people that you don't really looking at that safety, security for a time and on hearing that but I think what you also really need to overlay is that emotional state of it that's yeah.
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Well this values like are you going to live a life that you love and what's your purpose and vision and all of that stuff.
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Well and obviously that matters, you know, with how you want to do it and then how if there's money to facilitate that or not, depending on what that life you want looks like. Yeah.
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Yes, absolutely.
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Sorry. You can go and spend money. Feels good.
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Yeah. I feel like I have all of my I follow the team say money plan system. Yep. All our money's automated. It comes in, it goes in and it does its job. I love it. So many automations in my internet banking. And it has. I've been running out of money. It hasn't been lasting me like I have my living expenses dropping.
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Weekly.
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Every week, consistently I am. It feels like I'm doubling how much I'm taking and from somewhere else, not loving it and always thinking, you know, this morning, what am I doing? Like I feel like I'm not doing anything particularly extravagant. There's nothing massive going on, you know, just doing stuff.
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I think it's just the cost of living.
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Well, I need to do a review. I think there's absolutely cost of living stuff in there. Like we all know that buying a bag of groceries is $75 for nothing. Yeah, it's just ridiculous. So I do want to go. I'm absolutely going to review the last two or three months and look at them side by side to see what's going on for me because I need to.
00:11:04:00 - 00:11:27:10
Yeah, because where I'm pulling it from is like holidays, gifts. So like coming into Christmas and all of that season, I'm like, Yeah, yeah, there's not much. So what I'm doing is I'm pulling it out of short term goals and leaving my longer term goals, which is traditionally not what I've done. I've always, you know, kept going on the holidays or doing whatever and not put it to my future.
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But something changed in me in the last year where we really started, or I was maybe I don't know what clicked or changed and that future resilience part for the first time, because there's three components of financial wellbeing where we say we can meet our everyday expenses, we can have some money left over to enjoy a loss plus feel, you know, secure in our future as well.
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So that last component I have really protected and worked on for that. I feel like the very first time I'm and it excites me. I don't want to take away from that. Yeah I am. Yeah. So it's just that now it's the balance between the everyday and then the short term goals type stuff. Yeah. You know. Yeah. So I know I do a bit of a review.
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It's kind of annoying.
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But it's a really good way, you know, if you step out, it's a really good way of looking at it because you know, where I'm at too, with my truth is actually moving more towards a bit more for today actually. Yeah. And a bit less tomorrow. But yeah where I've, I've focused on that resilient stuff at the.
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End of a very long time. You did it the other way around.
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Now I'm running out of time.
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They can do that plenty of time. Focus is the right time in the right place because it's here now and you there. But yes, but being able to, you know, if there's one message that everyone takes away from today is really if you can consciously always think about how much I want to spend today versus tomorrow, and that will change depending on circumstances and what's going on in life.
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Because when you can be deliberate about that, sometimes you will be planning more for the resilience and, you know, longer term and other times you need to spend more for today and that could be inside your control or outside your control. That can be your living expenses. It could be because you've got kids that cost money in your life stage. That's right.
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All sorts of things at some. But make it a deliberate choice.
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But what I know that I need to to move out of that feeling is the only way I can describe it is look at the numbers. I need to get out of that and then I can just look at it and then I can decide whether these are changes I can make or not.
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Yeah. Yeah. It's that look, it's exactly where I am, even with what I was talking about before. The way I can get comfortable with it and the bit I haven't done is how much is going to take off the feather future. Yeah, I need to do that. So yeah, that, that's the practical step. That's it. You know, knowing how much we need a year to live and then so we started that work needs to work on the spreadsheet also to review that for the year ahead and then yeah, and based on that is like, okay, well this is how much we're going to be short like that resilience planning again, how is it going to come from? How much does that impact? And it's just it's getting your head around the numbers. Yeah.
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And then be okay with it or not or change or do make the decision, whatever.
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You're not exactly your choice. Exactly. Other than you know. So yes, that'll take some of the fear out of it.
00:14:51:09 - 00:15:01:03
Also, I was going to say while you were talking, I found out yesterday that she's got a holiday cash stash. Oh. So where I was worried about holidays were good.
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He's going to go to school. Oh, my God.
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And then he goes, No, you knew I've told you. And it's like, been in one ear at the other. And I'm like, Yeah, you know, I married you for your money like yours.
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Oh, gosh. So he has a cash stash.
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He goes, Nice people. His comment was this: Most women would be, you know, all perfect if they knew there was some money. And I'm like, Well, I told you, you just forgot. That's it. I'm sure I can't say it. It's not real. Yeah.
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Yeah. As long as Yeah.
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But I get yeah, there's a holiday kind of hiding of that person I hope. Yeah. Oh right.
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Yeah. Yeah. Well, he needs something not to exit his exit plan.
00:15:45:01 - 00:15:50:04
Which draws this right in 1204 to time. Yes it is the topic.
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Is when a relationship ends. What happens to the house, Right.
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Oh, my God. Oh.
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What happens when you. Who do you have an answer to this?
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Do we have an answer to this? There's so many. It's a big question, right?
00:16:04:00 - 00:16:06:22
Because you can have the house. You can have this person. Yeah, right.
00:16:06:22 - 00:16:28:13
Is the $1 million in cash maybe. Hey. Yeah. Yeah. So where to start with this topic? So we see lots of people that might be navigating a financial separation and obviously a marriage or relationship separation. Yes, we should start with that.
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Yeah, that's what's happening. Yep. Which results in a financial separation. Hasta la vista. Who gets what?
00:16:36:03 - 00:17:02:10
Exactly. So. So the case is generally what people do and the people that we've spoken to we speak to have decided to separate before they come and talk to us. I mean, they're trying to navigate through whether or not generally it does start with whether I can get the house. It's a very common starting place where you're ready to look at the numbers.
00:17:02:11 - 00:17:43:08
That's right. Where am I going to live? What will I have? Can I afford to keep the house or will I have enough money to buy another house? Will I have to rent? Where will I live? Yep. Yep. Mm. And I know that this always goes this way. The gender biases and who does what and role playing our society and I can like the amount of women who want to keep the family house and stability or saying and I don't know like maybe also more women engage us you know so we're biased in that respect.
00:17:43:11 - 00:17:44:13
I would say.
00:17:44:15 - 00:17:50:03
We definitely do have guys as well, but it would be the guys who are practical about it. It's just what it is. And the women I just hear the language around. I need to live close to the kids while they're still in school. They need to be he or I want to keep the family house for stability. But it's not always the case.
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No, that's right.
00:18:03:20 - 00:18:30:19
I've got one at the moment. So I'm just thinking that there was an assumption straight away because I'm talking to a guy and a girl who are separating and they've got a teenage child still. And there was an assumption made that she couldn't keep the house. So that she would let him keep the house. That was their top priority so that their child had that stability in the household.
00:18:30:21 - 00:18:57:18
You know, that was super important for them. But yeah, the assumption was that she couldn't afford it or that and also she's continued to pay half of the mortgage, even though she's not earning half of the wages, like giving herself away and then not asking for an equal share either at the end of the day, because the priority was still the child, but not her own resilience yet.
00:18:57:20 - 00:19:38:17
And the conversation, you know, so it's hard like our mentality and our expectations and our self-worth through this and what we write is priorities and importance. You know, it's very interesting to see this as an outside in party to a financial separation, because sometimes we get very caught up in the right now instead of the long term picture, you know, that big resilience picture of what will this look like in five, ten, 15 or at retirement for me, because it's hard because you want to move away from what you're in currently and you just want to get that done and tied up with a bar sometimes.
00:19:38:17 - 00:19:47:19
How do I get out of this situation? So it does come down to priorities. And this is I've got lots of thoughts on how to navigate this because you don't do it very often.
00:19:47:21 - 00:20:04:24
No, no, that's right. And it is extremely stressful, probably, you know, similar to, you know, it's grief really. It's going through a loss that is massive and.
00:20:04:24 - 00:20:09:17
Changes your identity, who you are, how people perceive you or your thoughts of that.
00:20:09:17 - 00:20:36:12
Mhm. Yep. That's right. So generally and this is all generally and when you're talking about the gender differences, so that made me think of something. So I'm going to say general, I don't want to stereotype people, but we are different, you know, guys and girls are different and I do think guys want the practical in what it looks like and to navigate it and sometimes wanting to get it sorted, done and dusted and sorted as quick as possible.
00:20:36:14 - 00:20:52:01
But I find they can start like that. And then the emotional overlay comes later and this is and the reality sets in. Yes. That it's actually more than just the numbers in the not simple yet way.
00:20:52:22 - 00:20:59:23
Women maybe go the other way and take it slower working it through engaged later.
00:21:00:00 - 00:21:01:23
Yeah.
00:21:02:00 - 00:21:41:04
This is Yeah. So yeah that's you know that's what we see And these processes can take 1218 months, you know, two years with all the emotional overlay and then the practical distribution and agreement, you know, take, take a long time. So which brings us, you know, to maybe how to, how to navigate poly. Let's go there, you know, from a financial wellbeing sense, we would say to actually have the conversation with your partner sooner like before.
00:21:41:04 - 00:21:59:05
It's not great. Hmm. Like if you can start having a really strong relationship and a conversation. Yeah. And planning in your contingency for if it did ever happen. Yeah. You know, I've got a theory that maybe, you know, that will make the relationship stronger.
00:21:59:07 - 00:22:29:04
Absolutely. Yeah. I would say that in any and I know we say this a lot, you know, talk about it sooner. We should be talking and thinking about how we're going to exit any sort of relationship. But before I want to come back to that. But I want to kind of here kind of talk a little bit more about like the possibilities of like, oh, the pathways this kind of goes down to like so we have those options of can we keep the house?
00:22:29:06 - 00:22:44:13
Like, who's going to keep the house? Does it need to be sold? So some of those are emotional conversations or whatever. And if it sometimes if it can't be resolved, you need to go and get other advice somewhere as well. Yeah, but like knowing what you can do will help sort out those.
00:22:44:15 - 00:22:47:21
To find out your information, that's the dating form.
00:22:47:23 - 00:23:06:23
What you can do. All right. So as an individual, everything is harder. I would say finance, getting finance and a loan as an individual and a single person is harder than doing it as a couple combined incomes. Yeah, the banks just look at it differently. So knowing what your options are can help me navigate that whole process much more smoothly.
00:23:06:23 - 00:23:30:16
So it's never too early to engage, I say, and I think the finance industry scares you off because you're supposed to come ready, you know, don't waste their time, all of that stuff. It just means you're talking to the wrong people, to be honest. Exactly right. So it should be okay that you go and find out all your information and find out you borrowing capacity, even if you're not ready for 1 to 2 years after that and you keep checking in on that process of how this.
00:23:30:16 - 00:23:51:14
Right. Because what it might mean is you might need some planning time because if you've been out of the workforce for a while, for example, you might work part time or you're borrowing capacity might be too low for what you need to do. That's right. So you might need to think about going and getting work and a job and, you know, that might take time.
00:23:51:14 - 00:24:10:04
That's right. You know, to set yourself up, to be able to keep the house, if that's your plan. So the sooner you engage to understand where you're at today, but the plan to get you where you need to be at today, as well as which path to take, Yes. It is really, really important. Yep.
00:24:10:04 - 00:24:25:20
Yeah. And then what we always talk about too, is what that's going to look like for you financially. Because there's one thing about getting a loan, but then what does your lifestyle look like? Where are you going to live as well? What can you afford? Does it mean you're keeping the house or is it living somewhere else too?
00:24:25:21 - 00:24:55:15
You know, and I've had some people who are like, well, I with what I can afford, I don't want to be living in that area, but I need to be close to the kids. So I'm going to rent, you know, for a period of time. So there's risk involved in that is like understanding this is all comes down to priorities too, because housing isn't all like housing stability, but your life and what you know, there's no point living on the other side of town if you never going to see your kids or something like that, if that's important to you of course.
00:24:55:17 - 00:25:14:07
So there are so many things where you can't just follow the rules like we like financially, it's not good to be out of the market. That was generally a rule of thumb. Like if you can buy, buy, maybe that's rent vesting or you're renting out a property, you know that you can move into later and all of those things.
00:25:14:09 - 00:25:46:20
Sometimes the feeling of you being in the driver's seat is really, really important in the process. So I, I think sometimes a really good strategy is to actually stretch yourself a little bit, to keep the house initially, because then that buys you time after the, you know, all the emotional change is gone through to sit for a bit and then reevaluate.
00:25:46:20 - 00:26:11:11
And then if you want to downsize or sell or do something else on your terms. Yeah, you've, you've maybe been in a different emotional state to make different decisions. That's right. So you know, and that, you know, obviously it depends financially whether you're able to do that, but also, you know, stage of, you know, where you're at like, you know, do you have kids, you know, school things?
00:26:11:13 - 00:26:34:08
Is it just you to worry about? You know, that might influence that. But sometimes I do. It gives a measured way to say, okay, step one, I'm actually going to stagger the way I think about this rather than the end game. That's right. So you might have a game, you know, one of the, you know, going to keep the house.
00:26:34:10 - 00:26:41:19
But my longer term gain is to evaluate actually what I want out of life. What do I want for the next phase?
00:26:41:23 - 00:26:42:19
Yes.
00:26:42:21 - 00:26:45:11
And then, you know, you're doing it on your terms.
00:26:45:11 - 00:27:01:04
That's right. And whatever your terms are, because your terms might be living in that house or it might be not. Yeah, you know what I mean? Like, how many times have I said I don't want to live where I'm living? Like, there's no way I'd keep our house. Yeah, it's just not on my agenda yet. Financially or otherwise.
00:27:01:06 - 00:27:02:16
Though, it's not, I'm not.
00:27:02:16 - 00:27:10:17
Beholden to that house like. And my kids are older. I know. I'm talking about me. My daughter does say I'm a peak.
00:27:10:19 - 00:27:15:14
May I? Okay, but pick me with me.
00:27:15:15 - 00:27:20:05
Oh, I would say me. It's a Meredith Gray quote from Gray's Anatomy. It's like me, me, me, me.
00:27:20:08 - 00:27:23:07
Oh, yeah, I got it on air.
00:27:23:10 - 00:27:27:03
You know, we're just talking about things in general, and I'm like, everything's on.
00:27:27:03 - 00:27:32:09
Oh, no, But it's. It's what it is. That's right. So, like, a good example.
00:27:32:09 - 00:27:54:22
What I'm saying is, like, do like the you might have an innate thing and the more you've thought about this, you know, so and your I approach life again pick me as you know what you know you've got your own core values that aren't your partners or whoever you decided to do life with anyway. So like, they will be a core driver as to how you navigate this.
00:27:54:24 - 00:28:18:05
If you feel empowered because you haven't been in the driver's seat with money before because your partner has been, that's very intimidating because you may not know where to go. You may not feel like you know how to ask questions, who to ask the questions to, or how to even what those first steps are. And that may have kept you in that relationship for a very long time.
00:28:18:05 - 00:28:50:15
And we do see that a lot of people just go, I'll just wait till the kids who've grown up and then I'll sort myself that I don't want to impose or imposition anybody. And I want to, you know, it's like, you know, so I encourage you to kind of elevate your position in the family slightly or in your own self worth to, you know, if we can navigate it as early as possible, which I think that you were saying, you know, it's never too early to ask questions, be involved in finances, not leave yourself on the outside of finances ideally.
00:28:50:15 - 00:28:58:21
But if you do find yourself there then and you're listening to this podcast, then you call us, okay.
00:28:58:23 - 00:29:05:15
People in your team, you will sit here, you work through it, they.
00:29:05:15 - 00:29:34:20
Bring you to talk to your friends about, you know, maybe they may not have done it directly themselves, but might have had somebody else who has and hook you up with the right person or yeah, you start the conversation and you might think that so many think our brains do weird things to us. Right? But if you can, the bravest thing you can do is start talking about it, and you'll find that most people can relate to just about everything that you're going to say.
00:29:34:20 - 00:29:43:02
Yep. Regardless, with little to no judgment, you might be very, very surprised. So just start on that education journey.
00:29:43:02 - 00:30:07:02
Definitely education and finding out, you know, what's possible. Looking at your own financial wellbeing, how am I going to make this work? Some experts along the way, you know, and people get really nervous about engaging, say, lawyers, for example, people, you know, they're expensive, you know, and they think, oh, you know, that's just an extra cost or, you know, is that right for me?
00:30:07:04 - 00:30:45:19
But from our experience, things can be clearer and work smoother. If you do have an intermediary of some description. So, yes. And there are alternatives to, you know, lawyers and solicitors out there as well that can help. You know, a divorce coach is a thing, you know, we can help you navigate either together. And we definitely see more of that these days, you know, where people are actually trying to navigate and be reasonable about the costs together to split up assets and things.
00:30:45:21 - 00:30:55:12
Or if not, a divorce coach can help you navigate that, you know, in a different way than just the legalities. But they can support you through that as well.
00:30:55:18 - 00:30:56:20
Yeah.
00:30:56:22 - 00:31:17:04
So engaging those experts sooner again rather than later, you know, around the numbers or, you know, a divorce coach and how the system works and what they can do. And because people have so many questions. But sometimes we wallow in the questions and actually don't go and get the answers. And it's just information.
00:31:17:06 - 00:31:27:19
We assume that answers is a problem. Like rather than just wallowing in the questions, it's like, you can't be helped. It's not good. I'll never be able to do this. So whatever. Like.
00:31:27:21 - 00:31:49:23
Yeah, but yeah, things like, you know what split, you know, what do I say all the time? You know, 50, 50, 60, 40, 70, 30, like, but we manifest all this stuff in our brain. Yes, but we don't go and find out some information. That's right. And then you can stress test those numbers. Obviously, if you get back into the practical.
00:31:49:23 - 00:31:52:02
That's right. And you can access it all, you know, work.
00:31:52:04 - 00:31:53:18
That's right. And work itself out.
00:31:53:18 - 00:32:08:16
That's right. Even if you know the numbers, it doesn't know you need to act on it yet because emotionally you might not be ready. Yes. But knowing the numbers. That's right. Are super powerful. You can even put it to rest for a while. Yes. Rather than do it down the track and leaving that fear.
00:32:08:18 - 00:32:26:21
So I feel like we want to wrap this up with the team. Say, take. Yeah, can we do that? Because I'm feeling like the team to take on this a few who ends up with the house is the original question, but it's like, how do we navigate the separation and divorce financially? And I would say think about it early.
00:32:26:23 - 00:32:57:12
Yes, it's never too early. Even if you're happy, right? Be empowered with your numbers. These are the preventative things to navigate a process smoothly otherwise, and if you haven't done those two things and you're there already, I recommend what you just said is get a third party involved as well. I would 100% do this right. I want external eyes looking at this too, because I want to do it fairly.
00:32:57:12 - 00:33:02:07
But you know what is fair? I can't objectively say that because I'm in it.
00:33:02:09 - 00:33:05:07
Right. And even about trust and I know.
00:33:05:19 - 00:33:21:16
We really do. And many trusts. But it's it's it's actually not it's just a fair intermediary to help navigate it and help understand it not Yeah, not all they going to take me down or, you know. Yeah.
00:33:21:19 - 00:33:42:10
It doesn't have to be a takedown and I would prefer to stay away from lawyers personally. Like I would totally get an intimate mediator who can navigate. And I'm saying this, this is assuming that you are in a position where you can amicably, you know, come to some sort of conclusion, which is often not the case in a marriage separation.
00:33:42:12 - 00:34:01:18
And the other thing is that I would get it done and dusted, signed with a little bow so I could walk away right as far as I would get it. A binding financial agreement sealed by the court? Yep. And then I can go and start my life afresh. Yep. And you know, I want to be empowered when I say this, like, I'm pretty happy.
00:34:01:23 - 00:34:05:12
I have no intentions. Cozy. But like, this is how it would be done.
00:34:05:12 - 00:34:41:12
That's right. The other thing I would say is in the Team C type, and I tell people it's so overwhelming. So you can't, you know, deal with the short term. In the long term, yeah. Times together. So strategically was a C dealing with a short term working best first and then working on your long term resilience. But I'm going to put a caveat over it because Mel mentioned something really important sometimes we just want to get the job done and we're not thinking about our long term resilience.
00:34:41:14 - 00:35:01:14
I would say put the thought and do some work in the numbers to understand your financial resilience long term. Yes, without that being the key outcome and things drag on for years. Sorry, but it's good to understand what that could look like and yeah, at least help it.
00:35:01:19 - 00:35:09:22
And what you are saying now. I feel like there's actually two components to that because what I'm saying, don't walk away from the table without your fair share is what I'm really saying.
00:35:10:03 - 00:35:10:23
That's all.
00:35:11:00 - 00:35:11:08
I'm saying.
00:35:11:08 - 00:35:14:19
Superannuation is a theme, right? Which is the one that comes to mind it.
00:35:14:19 - 00:35:38:23
Absolutely all assets and how we divide and they don't walk away with whatever is fair. And I'm in the situation. I feel don't leave things on the table because it's very nearly impossible to come back to. I don't think you can. Yeah. And then what you're saying is like once that is done, it's like, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater maybe take it bait, keep what you've got.
00:35:38:23 - 00:35:44:06
You don't need to make all of your actual financial decisions right at that moment.
00:35:44:08 - 00:35:46:16
Because I think that slows people down.
00:35:46:16 - 00:35:51:21
So you can keep the house. You don't have to walk away. You don't have to change your whole life. I'm all in that one moment.
00:35:51:23 - 00:35:54:16
No, I think about it's like my retirement pot.
00:35:54:16 - 00:36:13:11
Is a process. It's like sort out what you're getting if what you can keep and what the first stage is. Because it might be selling the house, it might be that is the only way around it. Or you're selling your share in the house, Right. And you're getting a payout, Right. What are you doing immediately? But it can be we don't need to solve all of life in one go.
00:36:13:11 - 00:36:17:19
That's right. Because that just paralyzes us. I think I.
00:36:17:19 - 00:36:36:02
Just want to talk about, too, because I feel like I've focused on like this, because we think about it from the point of view, from my game, from my pick me, you know, because it hasn't happened. So I, I've like I'm ten steps ahead, right? And who knows how it's ever going to play out. But like, what if it's all all that stuff hasn't happened.
00:36:36:04 - 00:36:49:08
You are in with a lawyer, you've both lawyered up and it's dragging on. What do we do then? What is the terms they take on when you are neck deep?
00:36:49:08 - 00:36:49:17
Right.
00:36:49:17 - 00:37:01:21
And it feels like there's no end or that you're going to agree. I'd like to get both parties on the same page to finally get this thing done yet. What do you say?
00:37:01:21 - 00:37:04:17
They're like, That's a tricky one because I think we see it a lot.
00:37:05:07 - 00:37:23:23
I think we do, too. I would first of all, think about the the people that you're working with and whether that's serving you or not. That would be the very first being like, why? Why is this taking, you know, so long? And I think people do get to a stage where they just want it done.
00:37:24:00 - 00:37:54:00
So if if who you're working with, if that's not working, you need a different avenue to find somebody to, you know, help you navigate that, have the conversations and work forward, which might not be solicitor's, for example, what happens in separation is because it's so fueled with emotions. And if somebody did something to me or whatnot and how those assets should.
00:37:54:00 - 00:37:55:21
Get to and who gets what.
00:37:55:23 - 00:38:20:01
So what I tend to see is that can be compromised, you know, are we being realistic about that? Like that's roughly how much hurt and pain have worn faces, you know, and what's realistic, you know, maybe you've got an eye on 70, 30 or whatever, But realistically, can you work with 5050? That's you can work with 5050, you know.
00:38:20:01 - 00:38:23:21
Yes. Is that okay? That's what you get. That's right.
00:38:23:21 - 00:38:36:03
I think that we get hung up on that. It's like we get I need the 7030 but like other is great example like that's again knowing your numbers and you're like well I can walk away with this yet you have that this is what we're doing. It's a compromise.
00:38:36:03 - 00:39:00:21
And it can be much more, maybe you can work through it and it can be much more amicable. If we can come to something like that, if it makes you life work, if you learn to work off that, you know that even in those early doors actually stress testing that out, not getting hung up on what that is, but understanding the difference your life's going to look like at different splits.
00:39:00:21 - 00:39:01:18
That's right.
00:39:01:20 - 00:39:03:16
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:39:03:18 - 00:39:12:19
So it's your team knowing your numbers again, we always say this, knowing what you need to make things work and what your options are going to be.
00:39:12:21 - 00:39:21:07
Yeah, definitely. And staying in approach. Yeah. Don't try and solve everything in one hit all at once. Yeah.
00:39:21:09 - 00:39:22:00
Yeah.
00:39:22:02 - 00:39:22:11
Great.
00:39:22:12 - 00:39:32:16
All right. Well, thanks for joining us today. I know it is a very niche topic, which you may or may not experience, but if you don't, somebody else will and you'll be glad you listen.
00:39:32:18 - 00:39:46:16
At The Money Collective we provide financial wellbeing premium coaching, mortgage broking and workplace financial wellbeing programs, which we couldn't do without the seamless support of our fabulous team.
00:39:46:18 - 00:39:58:06
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00:39:58:08 - 00:40:07:03
All content in this podcast is for educational purposes only and is generally nature. For tailored personal advice, please seek out a professional.
This podcast provides general advice only. It does not take into account your objectives, financial situation or needs. Before acting on any information provided, you should consider the appropriateness of the information and the nature of the financial product in regards to your objectives, financial situation and needs. We recommend discussing your personal situation with a financial professional.
Podcast by:
MEL PEARCE & DARLENE NEU
Co-Founders, Financial Wellbeing Coaches and Mortgage Brokers
The Money Collective
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